After 2 years LuAnn updates us on her purchase

DSCN1027.JPG

Dear Peter,

I just wanted to take a moment to update you on our lake house. If you recall, you helped me through the decision process. Thank you so much for answering all of our questions about the Lake. We are beginning our second summer “on the lake” and can’t tell you how happy we are that we bought a place on the Lake. We found a cute little place in our price range that has great frontage for swimming, boating and relaxing. I’d like to share a few things with you and your readers to update them on our purchase.

It took us four years to find the right place at the right price! One of the things we thought about as we looked for a place was the distance from our house. I had my heart set on a cabin at a lake about 4 1/2 hours from home. We ended up at the Lake which is only 2 1/2 hours from home and are really happy we did. Being so close makes it easy to get to the lake most weekends. Even a day trip to take care of a problem is an easy thing to do.

Although I worried about making this decision, it has turned out to be wonderful. I have learned to kayak and find myself out in my kayak at least once every day. I even kayaked around the entire rim of the lake last summer (and that took some time on an almost 500 acre lake!) We have wonderful neighbors and are making new friends at the lake.
DSC_0038.JPG
No place is perfect and we are finding out that there are quirks to owning a seasonal lake place. We have finished up many little maintenance jobs that needed to be done (always get an inspection, buyers!) and had a great time choosing new little odds and ends for the place. I’d like to recommend freecycle.org and craigslist for finding free and inexpensive things that are in terrific shape. Everyone tells me the little jobs never end, but so far they seem fun. All in all, it was a great decision and nothing beats sitting on the dock right next to the lake with a glass of wine! So, Peter, I’ll see you soon “on the lake”. Thanks for all your help. LuAnn

Purchasing a Gas Grill

Purchasing a new Outdoor BBQ Grill for your Lakefront

It was the start of a new season at my lake front home in Vermont (http://lakehousevacations.com/page-5140.html). I had just recently replaced my seasonal 700 square foot cabin with a modern day 3 bedroom 1000 square foot vacation home (1500 square feet if you add the walk out basement). See the section on replacing your seasonal cabin with a modern vacation home.

My wife and I have four teen age kids and it had worked out so that we had this weekend to ourselves. Yep, a sunny spring weekend at the vacation lakefront away from the worries of the world including kids! The increases your expectations of a great weekend!

It was 6pm and I had decided to cook steaks on the BBQ grill. I proceeded to light the grill using matches (How many of you know why you have to light your gas grill with matches?). I turned both burners on and dropped the match in. Sure enough, after a minute POOF! One burner caught and then a minute later the fire spread to the other burner….poof. Now, this procedure should encourage you to start you outdoor grill with a buzz cut.

I liked this grill, or, perhaps I just liked grilling. Or, it just could be that there are not much better things in life then having a beer while you are grilling and watching the action on the lake from you deck!

I purchased the grill six years ago from Wall Mart in August. I remember the call to my wife “honey, WE really need a new grill and Wal-Mart has this Great Outdoors grill for $99 dollars on sale”. What happened to our last grill? Well, it caught on fire as the burner rusted out and caused more of torch in the middle of the grill. That grill did cook your food very quickly though! My wife commented that grill was only 3 years old (I paid $75 for that one. It had 1 burner!). Her answer was ok, as she rationalized the $99 dollars due to the fact that we did use the grill every time we were at the Lake front which was about 14 – 18 weekends a year.

Back to the present. After my 5 year old “Great Outdoors” grill was warmed up, I put the steaks on closed the hood and walked away to water my flowers. Within a few minutes I saw a huge billow of smoke come from the grill. As I ran to the grill I could see that the plastic shroud that holds up the cast iron grate had caught on fire. It was burning very slowly and plastic was melting over top of the propane tank (stored underneath). Now at this point, I could envision my new deck going up in flames. I rushed for the hose. Turned it on and nothing! A kink….a #@#$* kink in the hose was preventing me from putting out the BBQ fire! Finally after 2 kinks I was able to spray the fire out (motivation to get a kink less hose?). What a mess. The worst part was that now I have to cook the stakes inside!! It’s like when you run out of gas!

After looking the grill over and trying it to see if I could cook using a single burner, my wife says “Honey, I wouldn’t try and use it now, it might start on fire again”. Now why would it do that? Then she says “I guess we’ll have to just purchase another grill”. DID I HEAR THAT! YES! How often do you get to look at your past years of experiences with grilling and then put them all into one purchase! I put on my Chef’s hat! YES…what a silver lining…a new grill!!

Ok…this was it! I was out to find the most serious grill that I could afford (or not afford). I was going to spend $500 dollars on this grill and get a good one!! Time to hit the internet and research. Google: Gas grills reviews. This led me to about.com top ten grills http://bbq.about.com/od/gasgrills/tp/aatp060402.htm. Let’s see: Char broil, Nexgrill, Napoleon, Sunbeam, Kenmore, Weber, Broil King, Broilmaster, Vidalia, and about 10 other names I have never heard of. Wait a minute, an outdoor kitchen! YES! OOOOOHH that would be nice! OOH $5-10,000. Not this year!

A “Great Outdoors” grill was not in the listing of top ten grills!! But I liked that grill! After researching the company, I found out that it went out of business in 2004! Parts were not available. Hmmm?

I started to think about all the grills that I owned. I bet that I have purchased perhaps 10 grills in my lifetime. Then I remembered that I have a 2 burner grill at my house (back in the real world) that I purchased in 1999 or 2000. Wow, that’s a long time ago! That grill is going on 10 years old. Two years ago I purchased replacement parts, the grates and a burner. Initially I didn’t think about this grill as I do not cook on it much (I am always at the lake house on weekends). I think that it was called a Weber Spirit 500. It was ok. It always cooked well. 90% of the time the ignition switch worked unless it rained (I did not have a cover for it). It is a small 2 burner grill in basic black. No, let me find something else…there is nothing special about that Weber grill. Or, perhaps, it was because that grill was at home, where the everyday stress abounds, work calls, teenage kids and their problems, and free time is nonexistent. Well alright, I’ll consider a Weber in my grill search.

After reading up on all the various grills, two grills emerged to me as the best choice for my Lakefront. They were Weber (Weber website) and Napoleon (Napoleon website ). The entry level Napoleon grill was the Prestige for about $800 (what happened to $500?). Weber had several grills at all price ranges. The Match to the Napoleon Prestige was the Weber Genesis. First I’ll discuss the Napoleon.

I was attracted to the Napoleon Prestige for several reasons. Napoleon offered a Lifetime Limited Warranty that seems to cover everything. I could imagine problems with this grill in 5 years and having it covered under the warranty. I liked the heavy duty steel used in construction, the simplicity of design, and that the burner control knobs were in the front. That was important as I needed space to put my food while I was opening the grill cover. In general it seemed like this grill was constructed well. I liked the way the grill cover opened and the wave grill bars. I also liked the great website. I was able to view videos about assembly, maintenance, and grilling. I was also able to down load the instruction manual. I thought if the grill is as designed as well as the website, then I found my grill. One difference between Napoleon and Weber is that this was Napoleon’s entry level grill! Prices go up from here!

The next step was to go and look at a Napoleon Grill in person. Eagerly I clicked on the “Where to buy” tab. Typed in my zip code, and 2 locations came up. One dealer, Matchless Stove and Chimney, was relatively close about 10 miles away. The other was nearly an hour south. I followed a link to the Matchless stove and chimney site. Not one mention on their web site about selling Napoleon gas grills or any BBQ grills. I called and they said that they did not sell BBQ grills. Next I called BAC sales. Yes, they are a wholesaler but they do have a retail store. It was open 9am-5pm Mon – Friday and part of the day on Saturday (For which I am at the lake that day!). I expanded the zip code search. Next there was one near Lake George. But, when would I get there? I asked my wife to see if she could drive to BAC and look at one. But due to her work hours, she would arrive as the place closed. I think that you get the idea. Access is important.

I was hoping to purchase a new grill inside of 1 week so that I could use in the upcoming weekend. Otherwise I would have to cook inside, yikes!

My first stop to look at grills was Home Depot. They had numerous makes, models and sizes to choose from. They had several Weber grills. I noticed that all their Weber Grills were models “E” without a side burner. Next I went to Wal-Mart. The selection was far smaller. They had the kid of grills that you buy and throw out in 3 years. I also went to Lowes. They seem to sell the same kind of grills as Home Depot.

My last stop was an outdoor store called Best Fire. They sold Weber grills. The sales person, Kyle, was very knowledgeable and helped me understand the difference between his Weber Grills and the ones at Home Depot, True Value, or Lowes. He called those companies “box stores”. Kyle explained that he sold Weber models that were “EP”, P meaning premium grill. At first seemed like a sales pitch. He explained and I corroborated on my own research that the difference between “E” and “EP” is the size and type of metal in the cooking grates and flavor bars that are just above the burners. In the “E” model, the cooking grates and flavorizers are cast iron. In the “EP”, they are both stainless steel. Stainless steel will last years longer than cast iron. There were a few other minor differences related to accessories (stainless steel handles, cook book, and more hooks for grill utensils). The price was also $50 more.

After years of thinking how nice it would be to have a side burner for corn on the cob, or beans, I decided that any grill I purchase needed to have one. Lowes and Home Depot only sold model “E-210” or “E-310”. This meant no side burner. Best fire had a model “EP-320” which included the side burner. True Value also had a model “E-320”.

Another reason that I decided on the Summit series Weber grill model “EP-320” is that I wanted 4 burners. Throughout my grilling career, I had always had 2 burners. That is great when you are cooking for 1-3 people, perhaps 4. But if you cook for 4 or more, or have guest over, you have cook in rotating shifts. You know, start the chicken first, then move it the side, start the burgers, then the dogs, etc. by the time you have finished, the first rotation is cold. The other problem is that 2 burner grills, especially the cheaper one, heat in the middle of the grill area. This causes you to have to shift the food around on the grill or the outside food might be really rare. With a 4 burner grill, I can choose to cook on 2 burners for just my wife and I, or, if I have guests over, I can cook on all 4.

In conclusion I looked at many makes and models of grills. I researched reviews on the internet. From this process I narrowed my choice down to 2 manufacturers. I chose between those manufacturers based on access, support and part availability. My choice was to purchase a Weber. The model that I choose was based on my previous grilling experiences. I wanted 4 burners and a side burner. I wanted my knobs on the front so that I had work space (that is why I move up to Summit series from the Genesis series). I wanted the “EP” models as I liked the stainless steel cooking grills. Best Fire discounted the grill $200 less than other places. Kyle was an honest sales guy.

Weber Grill

LFredereksen requests advice in lakefront purchase

November 3, 2007 Category Researching lakes | 0 Comments »
Hi, I got your email on the Property Owners Association–lake association. Thank you so much for the information. I think we will pursue looking for a place on your beautiful lake. Thanks again. LuAnn

LuAnn:

How did you get my email? Lake Hortonia is a reasonably clean lake with little or no Algae. My family and I love the lake!
I am biased. Lake Hortonia is relatively private and quiet. It has no Public Beaches or State Parks on it. That cuts down on noise and pollution.
We (The Property owners association) have done 2 lake treatments and eradicated 98% of Mil foil. Especially now, the lake is beautiful.

The depth ranges from 0-60 feet. Average Depth is probably 18′.

LuAnn is doing a good job of researching a lake front property. First, she has identified and area that is commutable from her home, about 2 hours away, then she starts researching various lakes both by internet and visits. Here is an example of her finding my email address off the property owner’s web site.
Hi, we have been looking for a place on a lake and recently came across Lake Hortonia. We live in Kinderhook, not far from East Greenbush. Could you take a few minutes and tell us about the lake? We were wondering about the water quality, clarity etc. We have a lake near here–Kinderhook lake, but the water is very cloudy and filled with algae. How is the water at Lake Hortonia? Any issues? Do you know the depth of the lake? Is it a very busy lake? Any info you could send would be appreciated. LuAnn

It is apparent that LuAnne has thought about purchasing lake front where she lives but has dismissed the idea due to pollution. She asks about Algae and depth. Both good topics when considering a lake front property. Another topic good to think about is size of the lake. Although, she may have decided that this lake is ample size (500 acres) as she has visited it. To make a more thorough analysis, LuAnn should see the lake by boat.

Thank you for the tip. Do you know Tammy? I had actually made contact with a Patsy, but she was not available when we could come up and doesn’t reply to emails. We had hoped to come up on Oct. 8 when my husband had a day off and a date previous to that when she had a baby shower to go to. Of course, he is not off this weekend, but I might be able to talk my son into coming up with me on Sunday if I can make arrangements to see some places. Do you know of any places that might be on the market by owner? If I can come up on Sunday, we will drive around the lake in addition to any places that are listed on the MLS. We don’t want a big place (hopefully under 250,000). Can you tell me about the taxes up there? The taxes on a 250,000 place in St. Lawrence County is 10,000! We just think that is too much. Also, thank you for your kind invitation to stop by and meet you and your wife. I will email you ahead of time if we are coming to make sure you’ll be around. Again, thank you for your time and help. LuAnn
Another good example of how LuAnn is doing her homework. St. Lawrence (1000 islands) is more like 5 hours away. This demonstrates that LuAnn takes her research seriously
PS Do you know the place for sale on — Camp Road? It is on lakehouse.com The Realtor listing the place is __ realty. Hope I’m not taking too much of your time. Again, thanks!

No…Because these cabins are mostly owned by “out of staters”, most use realtor’s. Taxes are around $3000 a year for a $200,000 place. . If were there, you would be welcome to stop. Yes. The owner purchased it only 2-3 years ago. Fixed it up and seems to be re-selling it. I don’t know him. I can tell you some recent transaction with Realtor A and she is very un-ethical.

In this email LuAnne is requesting information about the real estate sales people. I have experience that if you are not familiar with area, some real estate sales people will take advantage of that. When I first started looking at lake front, the first Realtor took us too little country stores to sample the cookies and “buy” into the local “ambiance”. Then she showed us lake front that was at the top or above our price range. After weeks of looking and not being satisfied, I met with another Realtor who showed us a perfect fit in terms of in our price range and direct lake front. As it turns out, this was the prior Realtor’s listing. She had chosen not to show us this listing as it was half the price!

In another example, I had a friend who made a full price offer on another realtor’s listing. Since I knew both the seller and the buyer, I found out that the Realtor held back the full price offer and instead presented her with her own client’s offer of $10,000 less. This seems un-ethical to me. The sellers would lose $10,000, the highest bidder would not get the place, but the listing Realtor would get 6% instead of 3%! Be careful!

In another scenario, one Realtor that I worked with never told me that the state of Vermont had a progressive tax on “purchases by out of state residents”. If we purchased and then sold the property in less then 5 years, we would be hit with a capital gains tax of 50%!

Hi, Peter. I’ve been up to look at the camp a couple of times and it looks pretty good. I was wondering if I could bother you with a couple more questions. (I couldn’t find the little red camp that was for sale by owner–maybe they’ve taken down the sign for the winter) I mentioned that the place we are looking at is owned by the B……–the one with the stairs, a little ways from the boy’s camp. I had a friend look at the place and she found some issues with the stairs/supports, etc. While that can be fixed, I am wondering if you know of any areas in that vicinity that erode/slide etc?
Do you know of any problems in the past with any of the hilly areas around the lake?
Do you feel that the water around this particular camp (if you are familiar with it) has a problem with excess weediness? Is Lake Hortonia an extremely weedy lake?
In addition to the capital gains penalty for resale, do owners from outside of Vermont pay more in property taxes?
Lastly, do you know anything about Rick from Rick’s remodeling? He is giving us an estimate on the repairs to the camp and I am trying to find out if he has a good reputation.
Finally, in advance, thank you so much for all your emails and help. If we are successful with this property, we hope to meet you and your family up at the lake. Thanks again. Luann

My Response - In general, No. I do not know of any areas that erode/slide. In general, from a geological stand point, Hills slowly come down. You are never going to totally escape the weeds! In some form or another, if you have lake front, you may get weeds. Otherwise, there is swimming pools(which also grow weeds if you don’t take care of them). Lake Hortonia is a shallow lake, so I would say it gets it’s share of “weeds”. Of course, some of the “weeds” attest to the quality of water and natural ecology. There is a small cove just to the right (facing the lake) of your lake front that gets pond lily’s pretty heavily. But right in front of your place, I have not seen many.

YES. This changed this year. Non-residents pay a higher formula. A bit of taxation without representation. Lake front cabins come at a cost.

No…..but I usually do my own work. So it means that I just don know him.

Good luck

Hi, Peter. Just wanted to let you know that we did come up to see the place on Camp Road. We didn’t end up having time to explore the rest of the lake and didn’t have cell service there, so we didn’t call you. The camp isn’t bad. I was wondering if you are familiar with that section of the lake and could tell me about that part. Do you know how deep it is there? Is that a section of lake that is being treated for milfoil? Do you know anything about a girl’s camp near this cottage? My son and I ended up eating lunch at Lakehouse on Lake Bomoseen–it was a great day for watching the sailboats. As seasoned lakers, do you and your wife have any other advice for us about things to think about in regards to purchasing a cottage on Lake Hortonia? Thank you, again, for all your help and time. LuAnn
I don’t think you will. The only noise that you hear is when they call the kids for breakfast. They ring a bell. But that camp runs 6 weeks. Pretty much….In the summer you have more “pond weed”, and the lake is shallow, so natural growth is abundant. But, it is usually clean. Remember - no public beaches. I don’t think it ever gets cloudy, shallow areas can get weedy.
Thank you again for your time and help. We are getting closer, but we’re not there yet. If it’s meant to be . . . LuAnn

Weather and climate considerations

January 19, 2007 Category Site selection | 0 Comments »

It is always a good idea to think about your needs/wants in response to site selection. Weather should play a critical role in where you would like to purchase lake property. As an example, you can compare tempature averages by using the weather internet sites. As an example : http://www.weather.com/outlook/recreation/golf/wxclimatology/monthly/graph/05732?from=36hr_bottomnav_golf

Post is under construction. Please check back.

Larger lakes (more than 500 acres) are prone to more severe weather then are smaller lakes. For example, larger waves, more wind, and a variety of water currents. Boating on Lake George is a much different experince then boating on Lake Bomoseen.  So, as climate effects the lake experience, so does the size of a lake.

lake size is another factor in site selection. Lakes are usually measured in surface acres.

Activity list

January 15, 2007 Category Activities | 0 Comments »
  • Water Skiing
  • Boating
    • Row boat
    • Paddle boat
    • Kayak
    • Canoe
    • Pontoon boat
    • Fishing boats
    • Speed boats
    • Rafts
  • Swimming
    • King of the dock
    • Marco Polo
    • Diving
    • Slide
  • Tubing
  • Water fights
  • Smores\campfire
  • Fishing
    • Off the dock
    • Off the boat
    • With kids
    • Adults
  • Hiking
  • Camping
  • Picnics
  • Cooking outside
  • Lake association activities
  • Socializing with lake neighbors
  • Flowers and Gardening
  • Summer friends